Is the Pope really conjuring up Lucifer in this video? I’ve been asked about this video so many times that I feel obligated to post a response. I’m also tired of repeating myself so from now own I can just send this link.
For greater ease of understanding we translated this phrase as follows: “How you have fallen from heaven, Lucifer, who arose in the morning.” But if we were to render a literal translation from the Hebrew, it would read, “How you have fallen from heaven, howling son of the dawn.” Lucifer is also signified with other words. And he who was formerly so glorious that he was compared to a bearer of lightning is now told that he must weep and mourn. Just as Lucifer scatters the darkness, it says, glowing and shining with a golden hue, so also your stepping forth to the peoples and the public seemed like a shining star.[1]
With Augustine’s subsequent approval, the tradition of Lucifer as a fallen angel became deeply ingrained in the medieval church. In an important book Deconstructing Lucifer, author David Lowe discussed how this Latin transliteration ended up in the older English Bibles:
After these early church fathers came St. Jerome, who translated the Bible into the Latin Vulgate language. Christian Protestants followed, such as Luther, Tyndale, Coverdale, Rogers, Calvin, Knox, and others, bravely leading believers out of the Dark Ages; a time when the Latin Vulgate translation of the Bible was the only choice for the printed Bible. When the early English Bibles began to be translated, they preserved the Latin word “Lucifer” but applied it only to the “morning star,” a reference to the planet Venus.[2]
In its original context, many scholars believe that this phrase helel ben-shachar is related to Ugaritic mythology concerning Baal and Athtar.[3] Isaiah often referenced the Canaanite deities by way of asserting Yahweh’s superiority. The Hebrew text reads:
The Lexham Hebrew-English Interlinear Bible (Bellingham, WA: Lexham Press, 2004), Is 14:12
Since the Latin language was not in use in Isaiah’s day, it is obvious that Isaiah did not write about anyone named Lucifer. It amounts to another Catholic tradition based on a mishandling of the biblical text. So what about the YouTube video, are they really invoking the devil albeit misnamed? When translated the Latin term ‘lucifer’ also means “morning star” or “light bearer” and in the Latin Vulgate it is used as metaphor for Jesus in 2 Peter 1:19: “et habemus firmiorem propheticum sermonem cui bene facitis adtendentes quasi lucernae lucenti in caliginoso loco donec dies inlucescat et lucifer oriatur in cordibus vestris”[4] which reads in English: “And we have something more sure, the prophetic word, to which you will do well to pay attention as to a lamp shining in a dark place, until the day dawns and the morning star rises in your hearts,” (2 Pe 1:19, ESV) No, the video above does not capture the Catholics evoking Lucifer, it’s just more YouTube paleobabble.
(Hat Tip Mike Heiser)
[1]Steven A. McKinion, Isaiah 1-39, Ancient Christian Commentary on Scripture OT 10 (Downers Grove, IL: InterVarsity Press, 2004), 121.
[2] Lowe, David W. (2011-10-01). Deconstructing Lucifer: Reexamining the Ancient Origins of the Fallen Angel of Light (pp. 71-72). Seismos Publishing. Kindle Edition
[3] Michael S. Heiser, “The Mythological Provenance of Is. XVIV 12–15: A Reconsideration of the Ugaritic Material,” Vestus Testamentum LI, 3, (2001): 356–357.
[4] Latin Vulgate Translation (Joseph Kreifels), 1311.
About Cris Putnam
I am thankful for the ministry of Chris as the The thinking critical mind is a blessing and a terrible thing to waste.
Isaiah 14:12-15
12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:
14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.
15 Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit.
Yes that translation borrowed the name “Lucifer” from Jerome’s Latin Vulgate, but Jerome was not the inspired author, the Hebrew prophet Isaiah was and he was not using a proper name in the Hebrew syntax and grammar.
Although Isaiah did not use the word “Lucifer”, the Latin Vulgate DID use it in the translation of Isaiah (Latin Vulgate: Isaiah 14:12 Quomodo cecidisti de caelo, Lucifer, qui mane oriebaris? corruisti in terram, qui vulnerabas gentes?)
In the song at the Mass, it is clear that they use the “Lucifer” word with big L, that I assume refer to Satan. If not, Why should they so stubbornly using the term?
Jesuit also named their telescope that placed at Mt. Graham. the name “L.U.C.I.F.E.R” stands for “Large Binocular Telescope Near-infrared Utility with Camera and Integral Field Unit for Extragalactic Research,” hellooooo…. can they make another name? Do the name HAS TO BE “LUCIFER”?!?!?!?!!?
for me, seems they are so “fanatic” in using the word “lucifer” , so suspicious…….
So the devil’s name never has been Lucifer? That changes things a little. Everyone running around claiming a “luciferian dialectic” needs to change things a bit to call it a “Satanic dialectic” instead. I know it seems as if splitting hairs here, but we must be armed with the truth, and avoid all lies in any form. Thank you for sharing this with us.
Wow, didn’t know that.
12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:
14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.
15 Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit.
I just stumbled onto the Vatican video and as a brought up Catholic who does know a thing or two, was shocked. There seem to be too many wires crossed here and maybe it would be better not to use the term Lucifer with a capital L because of the associations it has accumulated over the centuries. I was taught in Catholic school that Lucifer was a fallen angel, the brightest of the heavenly retinue.
If Jesus if supposed to be the morning star, how is it that he is also the son of L? I know that this may be infringing on the Mystery of the Trinity, but there is a Father and Son. And why would Jesus be associated with the planet, Venus? There is enough confusion with the conflation of Allah with the moon goddess.
Catholics should be more circumspect in joining up to pray with those who worship planetary deities. And that goes for Pope Francis who invited an Imam to “pray” for the conflicts in the Middle East.
Respectful separations should be maintained, not the all inclusive political correct embracing of diversity. It is wrong and bad. Judging by what is going on in the Middle East, with the constantly racheted up tensions and atrocities, such empty gestures don’t seem to have had any positive results.
lucifer , luceafar ,star of the morning the same thing…….. HYPERION
You seem to have received revelation directly from the Holy Spirit! Keep listening and speaking the truth! Bless you!
The writer of this article is either not telling the truth or does not know his/her bible. Lucifer is DEFINITELY SATAN.
Isaiah 14-12-15
12.How art thou fallen from heaven, O LUCIFER, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:
14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.
15 Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit.I
The King James translation borrowed the name “Lucifer” from Jerome’s Latin Vulgate translation, but Isaiah was not written by Jerome in the middle ages or by seventeenth century Anglican scholars under King James employ, the eight to seventh century BC Hebrew prophet Isaiah was the author and it easy to verify he was not using a proper name in the Hebrew syntax and grammar. The inspired Hebrew determines meaning not some later translator who misunderstands it. Jerome even admitted “lucifer” was a mistake but he just “liked it” so he left it in. Seriously is that a good reason to believe this? Nooo… So unless you are a Roman Catholic monk who has never seen a Protestant commentary, you ought to know better.
I don’t believe anything promulgated by the Catholic Church.
Why has no one discussed the Latin translation from a Greek source, where the word light in Greek is LUX and the word φωσφόρος (phosphoros) is used to describe the day/morning start. Lux Phosphoros when translated badly by people who didn’t completely know the language became Lux pheros or similar to Lucifer.
Yes, there is proper research on this I just can’t point it out at the moment.
Also, when read in context, the author is speaking about the King of Babylon. It is common to cast one’s enemies in a negative light or to mock them. It has been suggested by scholars that the speaker of that particular point in the text was referring to the King of Babylon, and mocking him, calling him “Morning Star” and “Brightest Light” in the heavens, even though he really thinks he’s a turd. He’s saying it sarcastically.
basically speaking, whether Jerome just used the name lucifer as satan or not. the pretext based on this is the same. everyone knows lucifer as satan and everyone associates the 2 combined. even the catholics do. unfortunately the vatacin has been associated with the Illuminati for how long now and and we all know what they are about especially logo with the eye of satan (lucifer).
why would the pope proclaim the name of lucifer knowing what millions of people associate it with?
i am a Christian and believe in the trinity father – son – holy spirit. there isnt anywhere else mentioned that satan is god nor mentioned that Jesus is satans son…..
I appreciate this systematic approach of interpreting what is actually going on with the Pope. I still have this question: Why would someone use “Lucifer” as a proper noun referring to God the Father? I understand what you are saying about Lucifer being “light bearer,” but as far as I know, in Latin, “lucifer” is only found twice in scripture and neither is referring to God the Father.
Why would someone use “Lucifer” as a proper noun referring to God the Father?
— it means “morning star” in Latin and it is actually used to describe Jesus:
“And we have the prophetic word more fully confirmed, to which you will do well to pay attention as to a lamp shining in a dark place, until the day dawns and the morning star rises in your hearts,”(2 Pe 1:19)
Latin Vulgate:
19 Et habemus firmiorem propheticum sermonem: cui benefacitis attendentes quasi lucernæ lucenti in caliginoso donec dies elucescat, et lucifer oriatur in cordibus vestris:
Biblia Sacra Juxta Vulgatam Clementinam., Ed. electronica. (Bellingham, WA: Logos Bible Software, 2005), 2 Pe 1:19.
What are yea all talking about. don’t yea all know that Pope Francis is the Rock that the Catholic Church is built upon.It is inconceivable that he would invoke Lucifer as anything but what he is EVIL, Satan Devil Beelzebub.
The question asked at the top of this page is: Did the Pope Evoke Lucifer and Claim Jesus is Satan’s Son?
Answer: NO OF COURSE NOT.
What a load of rubbish people talk, scaremongering!
All yea flexing bible knowledge quoting the bible right and left still never answered the question. Simple answer is all that was required.
Man is not a “Rock”; man is a fallen being incapable of saving himself whether he’s the “pope” or a vagabond sleeping behind a dumpster. The pope is a fallen man and not infallible in ANY sense. Only Jesus/God is our Rock. The catholic church/Vatican is a counterfeit Christian church and the answer is not simple as many people are deluded by this lying Babylonian harlot riding the beast (USA). What do you think the prophet Daniel meant when he said the son of perdition will exalt himself above all that is called God? Didn’t Pope Gregory change times and laws? Weren’t one of its heads wounded in 1798 as if to death until Mussolini gave power back to the Vatican? Perhaps you had better return to the research before you proffer such a baseless comment.
What is all that nonsense in the comment dated 08/28/2015?.
Jesus made Peter the rock of his church and upon that rock the church was built. NOT BASELESS
“I also say to you that you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build My church; (Matthew 16:18) Therefore the catholic church/Vatican is the true Christian church the Universal church, and I am not sorry to inform you that no matter what rubbish you write back, it will change that fact.
Yes Pope Francis is a man, but he also represents Gods ministry on earth. I believe some people like yourself are out of touch and perhaps in their own little bubble and would rather try to convince people of these lies than accept the truth in my comment above 08/25/2015 which I stand by. Please do your research properly.
Mt 16:16 And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.
Mt 16:17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.
Mt 16:18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
The “ROCK” is the “IT” that was revealed to Peter by the Father which is in heaven which was the truth spoken by Peter when he said, “Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.”
So upon this rock, the truth spoken by Peter that “Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.” was what Jesus Christ will build his church upon, no Peter.
Peter denied the Lord three times before the cock crowed.
Peter was rebuked by God himself at Christ’s ascension for wanting to make three tabernacles for Jesus, Moses and Elias at Jesus Christ’s ascension.
Mt 17:4 Then answered Peter, and said unto Jesus, Lord, it is good for us to be here: if thou wilt, let us make here three tabernacles; one for thee, and one for Moses, and one for Elias.
Mt 17:5 While he yet spake, behold, a bright cloud overshadowed them: and behold a voice out of the cloud, which said, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased; hear ye him.
Did Peter think that he was the rock upon which Christ would build his church?
Ac 10:25 And as Peter was coming in, Cornelius met him, and fell down at his feet, and worshipped him.
Ac 10:26 But Peter took him up, saying, Stand up; I myself also am a man.
What is all that nonsense in the comment dated 08/28/2015?.
Jesus made Peter the rock of his church and upon that rock the church was built. NOT BASELESS
“I also say to you that you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build My church; (Matthew 16:18Open in Logos Bible Software (if available)) Therefore the catholic church/Vatican is the true Christian church the Universal church, and I am not sorry to inform you that no matter what rubbish you write back, it will not change that fact.
Yes Pope Francis is a man, but he also represents Gods ministry on earth. I believe some people like yourself are out of touch and perhaps in their own little bubble and would rather try to convince people of these lies than accept the truth in my comment above 08/25/2015 which I stand by. Please do your research properly.
Peter betrayed Christ. If Peter betrayed Christ then what is that telling us about the church? That the one we love will also betray us. Doesn’t it say a false prophet first? We are not to call anyone else father, we are not to worship any other god/person and call him father. Priest are not to be called father and there are no saints. They were only enlightened men and woman who understood and were able to “see” the real beauty of Jesus. There is the father, son and the holy spirit who is mother. That is the trinity.
What is all that nonsense in the comment dated 08/28/2015?.
Jesus made Peter the rock of his church and upon that rock the church was built. NOT BASELESS
“I also say to you that you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build My church; (Matthew 16:18 Open in Logos Bible Software (if available)) Therefore the catholic church/Vatican is the true Christian church the Universal church, and I am not sorry to inform you that no matter what rubbish you write back, it will not change that fact.
Yes Pope Francis is a man, but he also represents Gods ministry on earth. I believe some people like yourself are out of touch and perhaps in their own little bubble and would rather try to convince people of these lies than accept the truth in my comment above 08/25/2015 which I stand by. Please do your research properly.
“I also say to you that you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build My church; (Matthew 16:18 Open in Logos Bible Software (if available)) Therefore the catholic church/Vatican is the true Christian church the Universal church, and I am not sorry to inform you that no matter what rubbish you write back, it will not change that fact.
Jesus was referring to Himself as “the Rock” as pronounced by Peter in the previous verse that “He, Jesus, was the Son of God.” Does it not seem odd to you the Jesus/God has been the Rock throughout the entire Bible but decided in this verse to give up His throne to this fallen man who is chastised several times for his demonic influence? Does not the grammatical structure indicate by the use of the third person in the second half of that statement state Jesus is referring to someone other than Peter? You are deceived and deluded by the Vatican’s lies and deception. Jesus never exalted any man over another let alone Himself. If you read the Bible you would know God is no respecter of persons, which is stated numerous times, meaning He is not partial. Nor does Peter or anyone else mention this exalted status anywhere in the Word. Pray for wisdom and understanding. The son of perdition resides in the Vatican.
CHRIST IS GOD HIMSELF!
SO HOW CAN THE GOD WHO CREATED EVERYTHING BECAME THE SON OF HIS FORMER MOST BEAUTIFUL ANGEL LUCIFER, WHO IS NOW SATAN AFTER CHRIST THROWN HIM OUT OF HEAVEN?
I TOLD YOU, THEY DO NOT UNDERSTAND THE HEBREW BIBLE BECAUSE THEY ARE USING A MAN-MADE bible.
LUCIFER IS A CREATED BEING, A PART OF GOD’S CREATION/GOD’S ANGELS, BUT HE REBELLED AGAINST GOD, N WANTED TO OVERTHROW GOD TO GRAB THE THRONE.
LEAVE CATHOLICISM N COME TO THE LORD JESUS CHRIST.
ACCEPT HIM AS YOUR LORD AND SAVIOR N LIVE FOR HIM N HE WILL REWARD YOU WITH ETERNAL LIFE, INSTEAD OF RECEIVING FROM HIM ETERNAL DAMNATION IN HELL BECAUSE OF WORSHIPING SATAN/FORMERLY LUCIFER.
exactly, most sensible comment so far!!!
The bottomline is, why does the roman catholic church still use Latin in the first place, when no one even understand? None of my roman catholic friends understand this, and they don’t even care to wonder and ask. People are deceived in this scheme of things and different interpretations of the old language, including unfamiliar and ambiguous terms only complicate things. Shouldn’t be the message be understandable to all? How sad 🙁
Who said the Roman Catholic Church still uses Latin. They use English where I come from. Are they not entitled to use Latin also in the Vatican if they choose?
The message is understandable to all who wants to hear the real message. It seems some people would rather try to complicate the message and twist it and interpret it to mean what they want it too rather than accept the real message.
That is what is sad about this whole thing.
So, Chris Putnam, if Lucifer is a non-entity, a made up name, then who is satan or do you not believe there is a satan, devil or whatever you want to call him / it?
Chris?
Pope is Anti-Christ
‘And lest thou lift up thine eyes towards the heavens, and hast seen the sun, and the moon, and the stars, all the host of the heavens, and thou hast been forced, and hast bowed thyself to them, and served them, which Jehovah thy God hath apportioned to all the peoples under the whole heavens.” Deut 4:19 Among other scripture commands not to use celestial signs for omens, worship, or heathen practices, seems to preclude the fact that God would inspire his prophet to invoke a celestial body with no rhyme or reason! Scripture in Revelation clearly denotes “stars” as angels. I cannot accept that the prophet refers to Venus especially, when God knows Venus is a planet and not a star..
‘And lest thou lift up thine eyes towards the heavens, and hast seen the sun, and the moon, and the stars, all the host of the heavens, and thou hast been forced, and hast bowed thyself to them, and served them, which Jehovah thy God hath apportioned to all the peoples under the whole heavens.” Deut 4:19
Among other scripture commands not to use celestial signs for omens, worship, or heathen practices, seems to preclude the fact that God would inspire his prophet to invoke a celestial body with no rhyme or reason! Scripture in Revelation clearly denotes “stars” as angels. I cannot accept that the prophet refers to Venus especially, when God knows Venus is a planet and not a star..
What??? This article completely lost me… What does any of this mean? I don’t feel like the original question was ever answered and what does venus have to do with the devil? Please elaborate for me because I am clueless as to what I just read. Thanks!
All the babble about names and meanings is
Nonsense. Satan = adversary/ lucifer = light =dawn. All names have meaning like jacob= heel grabber so the ideology about names is for the stupid. I know these demons are worshipping venus/ satan /son of the dawn/ and there are a million more names he go buy El= god /elohim= gods. If it’s not yahweh it’s satan bottom line.
So according to this author this is just a simple misunderstanding based on the Latin Vulgate, they used Lucifer in Isaiah 14:12 to signify Satan and in 2Peter 1:19 as a metaphor of Christ. So in this video;
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dcpVrtv2t-M&feature=youtu.be
They were not invoking Satan, only the metaphor of Christ as used in 2Peter 1:19.
Well your explanation has one huge flaw, in the video they were clearly not invoking Lucifer as a metaphor of Christ as they said that “Christ was his son”. So your clarification makes no sense.
Satan is the father of confusion and lies so you along with the Universal (Catholic) Church are trying to make people unsure they heard what was clearly said. However, this is not a language issue, it is just another confirmation that the “seat of St Peter” (the pope’s throne) is also the “throne of Satan” [[Rev 2:13]] as began by its original pontifex maximus, General Constantine.
God loves demons, wont send them to hell but God is all too happy to make Satan happy and consign us to hell over something stupid Adam did that He should have stopped but never did. Why is that? Why do we are we blamed for something Lucifer did and we take the fall for devils and Lucifer? How does that make sense? Why not create all people and not just a few thousand believing in God so conversions wouldn’t be needed? Btw sexual harassment lie enforced brings joy to the devils of hell as does calling whistling street harassment. That lie that they wont apologize for brings a smile to Belials face and the devils to. Too bad God didn’t forgive the devils and cast the devils out of the devils.
The beast has given the head of this “church” his seat.
Satan wants God like worship on earth, just like he wanted it
In Heaven. That is why he was kicked out along with 1/3 of the heavenly
Angels. He wants worship. It is just as it seems, nothing secret or mysterious.
This beast power is in the Vatican. Satan worship, Luciferian worship and
Unbelievable acts of worship to Baal. Only God makes the Sabbath day holy. Saturday.
The Catholic head has changed Gods holy day to Sunday. THIS
IS SATAN WORSHIP. Come out of Babylon!!!!!!!!!! The flood is at the door!
stop making excused and dancing around what he said. lucifer, satan, the devil, master deceiver, he is a fallen angel because he wanted to be God. we can play semantics all we want for the pope. we have many deceivers out there and to say that Christ is the son of lucifer is downright blasphemy. The only thing we can do is pray. This is a spiritual battle that God will handle.
As a child and adolesent, we were very devout Catholics and we thought the world of all of our pastors and their assistants. I even attended a Catholic high school. Our religion was the center of our lives and we relied on our priests for so many things and they delivered. We called them “Father” and they treated us like their children. We loved them and trusted them with our lives. Things have really changed with the Church and I do not have the trust that I had as a child.
So now they are saying that these things the Church taught us many years ago are all stories. Well, I don’t believe that but I do believe that some bad people have taken control of everything. As for the present pope, whether or not he is the real pope, he should be ashamed to say the things he is saying and has been saying for some time. I simply cannot believe this! And furthermore, who made up the stories and why is it all changing now? That would make him part of the fraud, would’ it? What a joke.